Workshop #266: Dumeh by Michael Chadwick
tuts workshop

Workshop #266: Dumeh by Michael Chadwick

on Feb 2nd 2013 with 7 comments

This track has been submitted for your friendly, constructive criticism. What useful feedback can you give the artist? The floor is yours to talk about the track and how they can fix problems in and improve upon the mix and the song.

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Description of the track:

I always wanted to write a symphony, because it seemed like the ultimate legitimacy as a composer. So, off and on over the years I’ve tinkered with this piece, which is in traditional fast-slow-fast symphony. It’s definitely a more modern take on the style, however.

I’ve never taken any formal musical training, but I’ve played guitar for over 16 years and picked up other instruments, real and synthetic, here and there. I love the lush sound of an orchestra, and Dumeh is my attempt to create my own version of it.

As it stands, it’s completely sequenced with Logic Studio, using the Native Instruments Session Strings library and several stock Logic virtual instruments (and a live guitar recording near the end).

Artist’s website: nebyoolae.com

Terms of Use: Users can stream the track for the purposes of giving feedback but cannot download or redistribute it.

Have a listen to the track and offer your constructive criticism for this Workshop in the comments section. Feel free to offer any type of advice – arrangement, mix, lyrics, performance. And remember to play nice – be constructive!

Need constructive criticism on your own tracks? Submit them for a workshop using this form. Most but not all submissions are published. There may be a wait of up to two months.

 
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Adrian is writer and editor for Audiotuts+ and Envato Notes. He has been playing keys and acoustic guitar for three decades, and has six kids. Follow him on Twitter at @envatoaudio.  

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  • sudhingr8

    good one bro… my comment would be to put some more life into the snare

  • PoMo

    I like it a lot. I am in the process of learning to do this and you are way ahead of me at this point. I am working with Miroslav Phil, but I have EWQL Silver on the way. I really like the mix of modern and classical instruments, and the modern composition. The only think I would say is that the strings sound very synthy, and maybe that’s your intention. For me, they take away from the lovely moods of the piece because they pump instead of flow. If you want to change that, here’s an AT tutorial you might find interesting:

    http://audio.tutsplus.com/tutorials/production/making-a-convincing-melody-with-sampled-orchestral-strings/

    • http://profiles.google.com/michael.chadwick Michael Chadwick

      I will be sure to check that out. So many good tutorials on this site!

  • http://www.facebook.com/djempirept Jorge Santiago

    See holliwood ;) Vengeance ;)

    Best Regards Mister Empire of Portugal

  • screenwright

    As I have commented on some other workshop pieces, this style of writing is pretty close to some work I have done in the past, including adding pop/rock elements to traditional orchestral writing. I am completely self-taught so I am no expert, but I did notice a few things after listening to your piece four times that may be of some help. There are some interesting ideas going on in this piece, but I feel like at times your orchestration/arrangement and maybe some technical things are working against you.

    The first thing I would recommend is checking the velocities of your notes. The piano part in particular sounds really “heavy handed” at times, as if the player is banging on it as hard as possible. This may be intentional, but I think it robs your piano part of both musicality and dynamic interest in those sections.

    I’d also check some of your chord voicings. I noticed in several places what I think are some unintended dissonances. The notes may all fit the harmony you are going for, but if two different instruments are playing non-unison/non-octave chordal tones that are too close in timbre, it can cause some harsh dissonance, even though it technically shouldn’t. It’s usually a simple fix, though, just remove the offending notes or change the voicing. Moving one note to a different octave can sometimes eliminate the problem without altering the harmony at all.

    I’d also check your timing on a few elements. Some notes just feel like they are hitting too early or too late. I know some people are totally against quantizing orchestral music, but I tend to think it is a good idea unless you are a top notch keyboard player; professional orchestral players tend to be pretty precise. Quantizing to a grid and then using “humanize” in Logic to add some variability will usually help remove any “robotic” feel; slight variance is the key. One specific thing to be aware of in terms of timing an orchestral mockup is the slow attack on legato strings; sometimes you need to set a negative delay on the MIDI track to get the notes to hit on time due to the slower start. (Human string players build this in automatically.)

    I always recommend thinking of orchestral tracks as if you were writing for a real orchestra; if you are supposed to be writing four voices in the violins, two voices in the violas and two voices in the cellos, for example, make sure you are consistently thinking of your parts in this fashion; don’t have an entire section of violins all playing the same note, as this rarely happens in real orchestral writing. I also always recommend a good orchestration reference. My favorite is “The Technique of Orchestration” by Kent Kennan & Donald Grantham. It is a dense book, but packed with insight.

    I’m not sure if it’s the mix or the arrangement, but for me the ending of the piece has too many ideas going on simultaneously. Starting around about 7:30, it almost sounds to me like there are two different songs playing because there is so much going on. Usually you will build a big sound with an orchestra by doubling a limited number of parts across the sections of the orchestra. There are so many parts going on during this section that I can’t pick them all out. My recommendation would be to either remove some of the parts or lengthen the section to allow you to give each musical idea a chance to be heard as sections/lines are added and subtracted. This is just my opinion, but much of the last section of the piece seems to lack “focus”.

    Finally, I’d like to share a thought on your text description of the piece, in particular, your use of the word “legitimacy”. I have played with several orchestral groups over the years and without exception, the other players in those groups have looked down their noses at me from the moment I arrive with my bass guitar (my primary instrument) in hand. They don’t care that I also play the tuba. They don’t care that I have to improvise most of my bass parts on the spot based on a lead sheet and years of music theory training. I am just some “rock and roll guy” and not part of their “club”. I’m not trying to offend any orchestral musicians; this has just been my personal experience, and every situation will be different. My main point is, don’t look for “legitimacy” in the eyes of others. Do your best to learn your craft, listen to constructive feedback, have a unique voice and then just do your thing.

    • http://profiles.google.com/michael.chadwick Michael Chadwick

      Thank you very much for this detailed response. If nothing else, having this track taken seriously enough for such useful critique is a compliment all of its own.

      Since the whole thing is sequenced (none of it is played), that readily explains the velocity issue. Never having been in an orchestra, let alone played most of the instruments in one, leaves me at a loss for writing “for” one. I know lots of composers can do this, however, so I’m gonna keep trying.

      The end goal is to have a real orchestra play this piece, so I just need to get it “close enough” to be playable by humans, and then I can kind of leave some of the nuance up to them, right? :P

      • screenwright

        This tutorial on velocities in Logic (http://audio.tutsplus.com/tutorials/production/7-ways-to-use-and-edit-midi-velocity/) made me think of this piece again. Check it out and pay particular attention to the “Dynamics” and “Velocity” track settings. I think these tricks could quickly help your piano part gain some more life.

        It helps to understand that your ultimate goal is performance. That means this is basically an orchestral “mock-up”. While not the ultimate deliverable, a mock-up is an important tool for communicating your intent to others. Orchestral works are a collaboration by default between composer, conductor & musicians. Getting the mockup as close to your vision as possible helps ensure everyone understands the creative direction of the piece, and helps you make decisions and changes with minimum expense.

        You are correct that human players add nuance, but orchestral players will rarely orchestrate for you or improvise on the spot. Remember, each player only sees their notes and maybe their neighbor’s notes; orchestral players don’t play from lead sheets. The conductor and composer are generally the only ones who see the full harmonic landscape of a piece. “Close enough” sometimes works in a very small ensemble, but with an orchestra, there are just too many moving parts. “Close enough” leads to composer and conductor “orchestrating on the spot” with the entire orchestra waiting, which costs time and money. (Even with “perfect” charts, composer and conductor will spend time in rehearsals making pencil changes.)

        Since this is a piece for performance, I would strongly advise some serious study in orchestration (a few weeks of self-study can give you a working understanding – mastery takes much longer). Better still, hiring an orchestrator can help ensure your charts are all in order and ready for performance. Again, a solid mockup will help the orchestrator make creative decisions that bring the orchestra in line with your vision and intent.

        Most of the best film composers in the world do not do their own orchestration. While many have the ability, it is too time consuming for their schedules. The composer produces a sketch and hands that off to an orchestrator who works with a copyist to produce charts for the players. An orchestrator can generally provide a quote for service based on the length of the work and the ensemble size you are writing for.

        One of the primary roles of an orchestrator is to ensure balance by creating harmonies and rests within sections, and doubling notes across instrument families. An orchestrator would also be able to utilize the woodwind and brass sections, in addition to the strings, to give you a bigger, fuller sound.

        If you or someone else is spending money to hire an orchestra to play your piece, investing in some pre-work will go a long way. If you want to learn orchestration yourself, this could be a great learning experience, but it will take lots of time. If you want it done right and quickly, consider hiring a professional, lots of composers do.